I dislike the Conservative ree’ing

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  • #273855
    Vknid
    Moderator

      I know the right hates when the left reee’s due to either being upset or to gloat.

      But I find it hypocrisy when the right ree’s to gloat over whatever.

      For example, today with the SCOTUS stuff.

      If you wish to celebrate saving unborn lives (and I do) I get that.

      But to simply thumb your nose at the other side just to say you “won” is being a sore winner and makes you just as bad as what you claim to dislike.

      I bring this up because I have seen a lot of nose thumbing and gloating on YouTube.

      #273868
      Mustangride1
      Moderator

        The funny thing is, no one person or group actually won. The Constitution simply prevailed as written.

        The reason people are celebrating this is the preservation of Life. Which if they looked at the states that still are allowing abortion then they would not be celebrating taking the victory lap. They should be buckling down and gathering supporters to fight to have it banned in all 50 states and all territories now.

         

        But hey its like when ANYONE beats BAMA, everyone not Bama celebrates the win.

         

        Now I did watch the news last night which I try not to, and found it interesting even in San Francisco there was not much in the way of protest. Did see on the news today that a few more are happening but they appear to be small and quickly dealt with. So will this be a big deal Federally? Doubt it will be much more than it has for decades. The battles will be in the states.

        #273883
        Vknid
        Moderator

          That’s right.  This is not an abortion ban, it’s simply the feds backing away from the issue because it’s not in the constitution.  But you know politicians.  They will try to whip up support on anything they can.

          #273886

          Pretty sure most of the people complaining are in states that still allow for abortion anyway.

          #273888
          Mustangride1
          Moderator

            Was watching a Live stream today.

             

            Reporter stopped two women and asked them if how they felt about the abortion ban.

            Woman #1: I am in support of it and the Court was wrong bunch of Conservative activist taking our rights, I should be able to get an abortion if I want.

            Woman#2: What fucking man you cheating on me with? That court you are complaining about gave us the right to be married, you (and right here the live feed mysteriously got cut off)

             

            I will say this, I know one house I would not want to be in today, Lucy got some splaining to do.

            #273894

            I wonder what the effect of gloating is. Three considerations:

            1. Peer pressure is a fact of life and I think one of the left’s main strengths is that they bully people. It’s hard to speak out against them and sheeple want to be on the winning side. Few people really stand on principle.

            2. On the other hand, taking the high road can be both perceived as strength or as weakness.

            3. Gloating inevitably makes the other side want to get revenge. This cycle has been going on for decades now, pretty much since Clinton / Bush. When political misfortune befalls the other side, people gloat. And then that side escalates things when they win again. None of this will end well.

            Also, the entire country should really split up. Left and right have absolutely no values in common anymore, and people are stressing out since they live in constant fear of their way of life being upended (a very real risk).

            #273896
            Vknid
            Moderator

              ” Left and right have absolutely no values in common anymore”

               

              This is only true when you speak of the extremes on both “sides”.  Most folks in the middle (which are most folks) will tend to agree on most things.

              • This reply was modified 1 year, 10 months ago by Vknid.
              #273899

              The center and the right have not moved much, IMO.  But they left can be summed up this way:

              FRcu9TeXEAMjvTM

              #273903

              I can relate to that cartoon. I always considered myself a classic liberal. Pro gay marriage, pro choice, pro 2nd amendment, pro free speech, pro free market, in favor of private schools, religious schools, homeschooling, and against censorship of books, music, video games, movies, pornography and for lowering the age of consent to 14 like in Europe and legalizing any recreational drugs that aren’t proven to be more toxic than alcohol.
              Basically any issue I’ll take a “liberal” approach on, meaning I want the government out of people’s hair.

              Nowadays I have the average lefties calling me a nazi – while they are supporting actual Nazis in Ukraine and cheering for Iran when they execute gay people.

              Still, from what I have observed, it feels the American right has moved a bit further towards traditionalism / authoritarianism. Especially on anything sexual.

              #273914
              Vknid
              Moderator

                “Still, from what I have observed, it feels the American right has moved a bit further towards traditionalism / authoritarianism. Especially on anything sexual.”

                Examples?

                And I find it hilarious you think the right has moved to authoritarianism but don’t accuse the left of the same when they are censoring and banning stuff like it’s some sort of sport.

                 

                “Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire.”

                ― Gustav Mahler

                • This reply was modified 1 year, 10 months ago by Vknid.
                #273941

                But the left never moved towards authoritarianism. Trump derangement syndrome just made them drop their masks, so now it’s more obvious to see. But the political left was always tyrannical. That’s literally their concept: “Gemeinwohl vor Eigenwohl” (“Benefit of society before benefit of the individual”) – with them as sole arbiters over what benefits society.

                Authoritarianism means the trading of individual liberties for a perceived greater benefit. It’s about forcing people to sacrifice their freedom.
                I.e. when the left tries to justify taking guns from the 99,99% of responsible gun owners for a hypothesized reduction in shootings – Effectively punishing the innocent for the deeds of criminals.
                Or when government in its infinite wisdom decides to tax working peope at 50% for the supposed societal benefit of welfare. Or when government forces you to buy a certain health care plan for greater good, or regulates how and at what price health care can be provided for the supposed benefit of universal access (but at the cost of quality of care).

                So which individual freedoms do conversatives want to remove for the “greater good”?

                Well, video games: “House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy told Fox & Friends that video games “dehumanize individuals.” In a speech today, President Trump pointed at video games specifically as a root cause for mass shootings. “We must stop the glorification of violence in our society,” he said. “This includes the gruesome and grisly video games that are now commonplace. It is too easy today for troubled youth to surround themselves with a culture that celebrates violence. We must stop or substantially reduce this, and it has to begin immediately.” ”

                Also it looks like the Supreme court isn’t done yet trying to sink the Republican Party’s chances in 2024
                https://nypost.com/2022/06/24/court-should-reconsider-gay-marriage-birth-control-clarence-thomas/

                Now I don’t actually believe the Supreme Court Justices are really right wing. If they were, they wouldn’t have allowed the election to be stolen. Clearly they are deep state operatives acting on orders. But the conservatives out in the streets right now applauding these policies that are literally designed to hurt them politically… yeah, they’re authoritarian. Their desire for government to enforce morality trumps what little desire for freedom they may have. And dooms them politically as well.

                • This reply was modified 1 year, 10 months ago by Wisdom.
                #273943
                Mustangride1
                Moderator

                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

                  The above is true. Like or hate Trump, he actually brought out the true agenda and lengths to which they will go to maintain power. He came in like a Bull in a China shop and broke a lot of their decades long controls and exposed many of them.

                   

                  There is a reason the Media is still playing up the Jan 6th commission when so more life impacting stories should be in the news. 1-6 does not affect anyones lives no matter how they play it. But the economy does <generic use of the word economy to me all finances> Store shelves empty do affect people.  Was the election stolen? Even some old democrats and a few liberals I know question it when confronted with the simple fact that we know investigation even when their is a confession takes weeks to months at times and yet NO meaningful investigations took place. That alone raises suspicions and doubt.

                   

                  But then you start tacking on the prices of things were dramatically less and him removing regulation that bogged down the process of many things (all of which require people to spend more money that goes to the government in one way or another) He broke and exposed their toy and they did not like that.

                   

                  But people are seeing it now, even the deaf, dumb and blind are starting to question it. But then came along ELON just when they “the left” started o get things back under control and has started to expose some things with the lefts favorite Propaganda site which makes them look at other things.  There is a old saying I try my best to live by:

                  “It is easier to be honest, tell the truth and not take things that are not mine, than try to keep a lie going.” Sooner or later a Lie is always exposed, always. Well, now the lies are being exposed. You will always have nuts that will stay blind, but eventually a sighted squirrel will find them, expose them and eat them.

                  #273947
                  Vknid
                  Moderator

                    The conflation here is that people say the left does this, or the right thinks that.  And the Republicans will do X and the Democrats will do Y.

                     

                    The reality is this.  The establishment government (both parties) are in there with the exact same goals.  What they claim to believe is of no consequence, their actions speak for themselves. They both rather rule over ashes instead of not ruling at all.  The dog and pony show of them fighting is just that. All for show.  Sure, there are a handful of independent folks but they are in the minority unfortunately.  Although their ranks are growing.

                    Secondly, there is another fallacy.  This entire thing with labels is bullsh!t.  Just because a small group of extremists who align more with one side or the other think something does not mean that entire group does.  This is a trick the media uses constantly and people seem to fall for it and end up repeating it.

                     

                     

                    #273953

                    Democrats and Repubicans, yes, as you say, it’s a dog and pony show for the masses. They’re the uniparty.
                    But left and right are really philosophical world views. The differences are very real and the labels are necessary. Granted, one could go more into detail, dividing up the left into greens, social democrats, socialists, communists, etc and the right into libertarians, conservatives, traditionalists, classic liberals, theocrats, etc and then still have room for a dozen or so ideologies that fall outside of the spectrum like fascism, anarcho-communism, monarchism.
                    The main philosophical divides are:
                    Individualism vs Collectivism / Authoritarianism.
                    Traditionalism vs Progressivism.

                    There are overlaps. Part of the traditionalist right is at odds with the individualist right and part of the individualist left (i.e. Bill Maher) is at odds with the authoritarian left (the censorship crowd). What better terms than left and right would you suggest?

                    “Secondly, there is another fallacy. This entire thing with labels is bullsh!t. Just because a small group of extremists who align more with one side or the other think something does not mean that entire group does.”

                    That’s not a fallacy if the extremists become the ones calling the shots. Again the example of Nazi Germany. How many of the ordinary Germans of the time do you think were okay with what happened in the camps? At most 10-20%
                    What matters is how a group affects others who are outside the group. That’s when extremism suddenly becomes very relevant.

                    The problem is that the common folk are so quick in their dislike or fear of others, that they will sometimes turn to extremist leaders. The common German disliked Jews, so they turned to Hitler, who then went way further than the vast majority wanted. Similarly, the common Democrat may just want some form of universal health care or welfare, or have a problem with police brutality (which should be more of a right wing issue if you ask me), but then in their foolishness may turn to vote for an extremist like Obama or AOC.
                    Likewise, the average conservative probably doesn’t have a problem with gay people or sexual education and just has a problem with kindergarten kids being taught about anal sex and doing drag queen story hour. But may elect more radical minded people who may indeed bring back anti-homosexuality legislation (homosexuality between men was still illegal in Texas just 20 years ago).
                    All i’m say is: we should be mindful to never sacrifice individual liberty in the culture war. Because the power given to government to go after people we don’t like today will be used to go after us tomorrow.

                    #274139

                    I fully agree with the name of the thread. I dislike right wing reeing just as much as left wing reeing.


                    @Legatus_Legionis
                    that’s how societies evolve. A position on something won’t necessary be stationary forever. 200 years ago saying ”slavery is based and women shouldn’t vote or go out from the house” was normal but those positions became outdated. 50 years ago saying gay people are icky and shouldn’t be able to adopt or get married was based but today outdated (in the civilized countries at least, there is still some work to do in let’s say muslim countries). People need to re-think their values and catch up or get left behind when societies evolve. And I’m not saying to blindly accept what is the new norm, as I oppose that identify as anything stuff but at least try to open your mind more.

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